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October 18, 2017, 04:06:48 AM
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Author Topic: Dragon Ball Super  (Read 2906 times)

Offline TypicalIdiotFan

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Dragon Ball Super
« on: December 10, 2016, 03:30:25 AM »
Just making this thread for one reason, and that's the glory that was Arale coming in and wrecking shit, Vegeta breaking the 4th wall, and Beerus getting the worst case of dysentery.  Even the God of Destruction couldn't avoid the gag. Episode 69 is what happens when a gag-manga character comes in and runs amok.  Makes me wonder a bit if Toriyama was having some fun with the One Punch Man arguments, because, yep, gag manga characters always win.  Always. 

Now, Arale vs. Saitama, that might end the universe.
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Offline gedata

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Re: Dragon Ball Super
« Reply #1 on: December 10, 2016, 12:47:19 PM »
This show blows, though I'm glad there's a place here to vent. Only reason I haven't made this thread yet is because I assumed I was the only one watching this to begin with.

The between-arc fillers are OK but every single arc has been bad.
« Last Edit: December 10, 2016, 12:56:19 PM by gedata »

Offline Reckoner

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Re: Dragon Ball Super
« Reply #2 on: December 10, 2016, 01:03:34 PM »
I thought the Goku Black arc was decent, but it ended rather disappointingly.

As a Gohan fan this entire anime was made to spite me though I swear.

Offline gedata

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Re: Dragon Ball Super
« Reply #3 on: December 10, 2016, 04:56:00 PM »
I thought the Goku Black arc was decent, but it ended rather disappointingly.

As a Gohan fan this entire anime was made to spite me though I swear.

It had a fine start but took too long to get to the point. I would be OK with this if the foundation for the entire arc even happening made a lick of sense. It tries to go for a causal time loop but it creates way too many inconsistencies for me to buy any of this happening. They also turned mah boi Trunks into a blatant Mary Sue with nary a lick of explanation before having a pointlessly tacked on cynical bullshit ending. Especially bad considering the other viable ways through which this arc could've been resolved, but they had to waste the re-introduction of both the Mafu-ba and Vegito for no reason. It's a bizarre combination of high concept sci-fi and half-assed attempts at fanwanking.

Not to mention, the premise of the whole Mai x Trunks thing is kind of odd. She's older than his mom ffs.
« Last Edit: December 10, 2016, 05:04:39 PM by gedata »

Offline TypicalIdiotFan

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Re: Dragon Ball Super
« Reply #4 on: December 10, 2016, 05:22:49 PM »
Oh the whole thing has been ****ing horrible.  What made Dragon Ball fun got eliminated in Z, and what made Z fun has been eliminated in Dragon Ball Super.  The only interesting thing about Super is that, on at least a couple of occasions so far, the good guys haven't actually "won" anything, which is kind of new.  Ignoring the tournament arc (which is full of so much bullshit I don't even know where to begin):

-Goku never actually beat Beerus and all this did was set up what Beerus and Whis have in mind for the rest of the story arcs.
-Frieza won, but Whis gave them a "do-over".
-Zamasu won, but was eliminated along with the entire universe he corrupted by Zen-oh-sama.
-Arale kicked everybody's ass because Arale is, was, and always will be Toriyama's favorite character.

(The last one doesn't count as an arc, it is just an inevitability)

And this sort of brings up the main problem with Super so far:  there are no consequences.  In Z you didn't know what was going to happen.  Sure, the Dragon Balls could fix some problems, but there were rules about them.  Those rules are mostly out the window now.  Now you have too many literal Deus Ex Machinas running amok that can fix things without any struggle at all.  Beerus himself can defeat any villain (if he feels like it), Whis can turn back time (despite it being a grave crime), and the Earth Dragon Balls are now capable of granting three wishes and are no longer limited by death rules.  Add in the already annoying Senzu Bean, which previously was hard to grow and very infrequent and now abundant because they need them for plot reasons, and virtually nothing bad can happen in Dragon Ball that can't be fixed, and that's before we get to those Super Dragon Balls, but thankfully those seem to be rather difficult for anybody to use with any kind of regularity.

The only other good thing about Super is that I actually like Beerus.  He is what I would expect a God (not God, mind you, but "a" God) to act like.  Immortal, apathetic, temperamental, easily bored, and a selfish jerkass.  He looks like an Egyptian God and acts like every Greek God I've ever read mythology on.  His rant against Gotenks in episode 4 or 5 about pudding, of all things, is kind of the Douglas Adams interpretation of immortal beings (most are born with an innate ability to deal with immortality and boredom; Beerus was clearly not).  Thus, I find him interesting, and his comic relief moments usually make sense from the context of his immortality.

Every other character is uninteresting and annoying as hell.  Worse, I think just about every regular Z character has somehow become even stupider than they were before.  Not that Dragon Ball has ever had characters with a shit ton of logic to them, but now things are just straight imbecilic.  The characters haven't changed one iota, the stakes have not increased because the risks are now nonexistent, and the scale of "power levels", which was supposed to be minimized or eliminated (which is what Toriyama was trying to do with BoG) is now at the most confusing and ridiculous that it ever has been.

tl;dr - shit sucks, Beerus is a bro, blatant money grab is blatant.
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Offline IKone152

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Re: Dragon Ball Super
« Reply #5 on: December 15, 2016, 01:42:16 AM »
I agree with you

Offline gedata

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Re: Dragon Ball Super
« Reply #6 on: December 15, 2016, 07:16:25 PM »
70:

Yamcha finally got his biggest moment ever since.......I guess that time where he beat up the invisible guy in Urunai Baba's tournament? Even now though, the series can't help but ruthlessly bully him the whole way through. He even had his chance to show up Vegeta, the man who not only had his pet killed him, but stole the love of his life. Vegeta literally had him beat at his own game, or at least he would've if Champa had any idea what he was doing.

Speaking of Bulma, maybe she finally feels a twinge of regret for not going after the literal super athlete and instead going for jobless, violent meathead with the worst temper in the universe. That's the sort of decision no sane person who isn't rich would make.

Honestly, holding any sporting event between people that can circle the planet 100s of times over in a second and casually destroy galaxies by farting on them is probably a bad idea, but it made for a fun watch tbh.

Offline TypicalIdiotFan

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Re: Dragon Ball Super
« Reply #7 on: December 16, 2016, 01:29:49 AM »
I have not and never will like Vegeta.  His past is not something you can gloss over just because he's banging the series' lead chick and has an adorable moppet for a son.  Hell, I might be able to forget his past if he wasn't also the biggest ****ing moron in the entire series.  At least half of the problems that crop up are because he didn't have the common sense to just not be stupid for five seconds.  Shit, everything he's done since showing up is one gigantic Vegeta ****up fest after another, but he's pushed forward as some kind of "combat genius" and that his imbecilic "Saiyan pride" bullshit is some kind of admirable trait.

But to top it off, no he didn't beat Yamcha at baseball.  Since he doesn't understand the rules of baseball, he completely ****s up a routine tag play.  Vados says Champa is obstructing and that allows Yamcha the base (which is true), but even she missed the most fundamental rule of a tag play:  you have to tag the player WITH THE BALL (or your glove holding the ball).  Vegeta just elbows him.  That doesn't count as a tag.
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Offline TypicalIdiotFan

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Re: Dragon Ball Super
« Reply #8 on: January 08, 2017, 03:12:56 AM »
73:

Ye gods.  I've come to realize that pretty much all of Dragon Ball Super is loaded with 'Member Berries.

"Hey!  'Member kaioken?"
"'Member Future Trunks?"
"'Member Great Saiyaman?"

Tell me one thing that has been done so far in Super that isn't a rehash of something we haven't already seen.  New characters?  Sure.  God ki?  Why not.  Everything else?  Nope.  They are doing their damnedest not to come up with anything new here, and while I can tolerate that for filler, it didn't dawn on me until now just how much the actual arcs and plots are full of NOTHING NEW.
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Offline gedata

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Re: Dragon Ball Super
« Reply #9 on: January 08, 2017, 03:56:33 PM »
73:

Ye gods.  I've come to realize that pretty much all of Dragon Ball Super is loaded with 'Member Berries.

"Hey!  'Member kaioken?"
"'Member Future Trunks?"
"'Member Great Saiyaman?"

Tell me one thing that has been done so far in Super that isn't a rehash of something we haven't already seen.  New characters?  Sure.  God ki?  Why not.  Everything else?  Nope.  They are doing their damnedest not to come up with anything new here, and while I can tolerate that for filler, it didn't dawn on me until now just how much the actual arcs and plots are full of NOTHING NEW.

There are the 11 other Universes but those have only been used to set up a tournament and another that'll start next month.

Saying that their nothing new is a bit unfair though. Sure this series is banking a lot on nostalgia (let's face it, that's the only reason you and I are here) but it's at least been taking old characters and concepts into some newish directions even if said directions suck ass (bringing back Vegito just to nerf him, the whole Future Trunks arc in general).

Offline TypicalIdiotFan

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Re: Dragon Ball Super
« Reply #10 on: January 08, 2017, 11:19:40 PM »
Yeah, but look at the promotional material for the 11 universes arc.  ****ING ANDROID 17 IS IN THERE. SE-VEN-TEEEEEEEEEEEN!  What the **** is he doing there?

Hell, I'm just going to list them all:

Battle of Gods arc is mostly new stuff, though most of that was shown in the film.  The idea that brought this to life from Toriyama's mind was to finally find a way to eliminate power levels.  He ends up failing miserably.  The then throws Emperor Pilaf and the gang into the movie and arc for reasons that are way beyond anybody to comprehend.  Meeeeeember?

Ressurection F arc is one giant member berry.  'Member Frieza?  'Member Captain Ginyu? 'Member Vegeta was a bad guy?  'Member killing Krillin?  Nothing of note happens in this arc except the debut of Super Cyan, an ability that still doesn't make any ****ing sense except to turn their auras blue.  Whis bails everybody out with a cheat / hax.  There is nothing significant here, no consequences.  This arc may as well not happened.

Universe 6 arc - 'Member Piccolo's stuff?  'Member Galick Gun?  'Member Final Flash?  'Member Vegeta jobbing to everybody so Goku can win the big fight?  'Member Kaiohken?  Hit is introduced, becoming as immediate a threat as immediately not.  I thought the Universe 6 fighters were interesting overall, though having the U6 Frieza still be a douche was just obnoxious, even if he was clever.  I thought this arc might be full of cleverness, and it kind of was for a couple of the U6 fighters, but then you had Cabbe, who was so ****ing pointless and retarded.  At least this arc tried.  Oh wait, I forgot one:  'Member Mr. Satan being useless but someone professing he's strong as shit so he gets into comical situations?  Yeah, this arc had Monaka, too.  Almost didn't 'Member dat.

Potaufeu Arc is mostly a joke filler arc, so I don't care about it much, but I could claim that some of the stuff there is a 'Member berry to Dragonball GT, which is weird, although Pan existing still validates GT a bit.  Could also be a Majin Vegeta 'Member berry.

Future Trunks arc is full of them.  Future Trunks alone is one, Vegito is another, but at least the Goku Black story arc was interesting until we found out who it was, then it was idiotic.  The only thing more idiotic was the way this arc ended.

This current bullshit has Yamcha playing baseball, Arale showing up for no reason, and Great Saiyaman.  Hit shows up again to be turned into a greater threat than he was before only to be once again neutered by Goku.  So now they're 'Member berry'ing stuff that happened just two arcs ago.

Yes, nostalgia brought us back, but I'm not here to watch nostalgia I'm here to watch new shit and have some fun with it.  We're getting some new shit, loaded with all old shit because nobody can think of anything new to do with the characters that already exist, and having everything being executed in the most inane way possible.  Yeah, DB Super is shit.
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Offline gedata

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Re: Dragon Ball Super
« Reply #11 on: January 09, 2017, 04:58:52 AM »
Yeah, but look at the promotional material for the 11 universes arc.  ****ING ANDROID 17 IS IN THERE. SE-VEN-TEEEEEEEEEEEN!  What the **** is he doing there?

Honestly with someone like 17, my 1st question is "wtf isn't he here right now?" since his absence is never actually explained

Generally speaking, I don't mind call backs as a whole. It's just that when they feel like excuses to do literally nothing new or worthwhile like in Resurrection F or as a gateway torwards  stupid retcons

Offline gedata

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Re: Dragon Ball Super
« Reply #12 on: January 15, 2017, 12:16:11 PM »
74:

Offline TypicalIdiotFan

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Re: Dragon Ball Super
« Reply #13 on: February 20, 2017, 05:13:14 AM »
79:

I will say one thing:  one of Toriyama's stated goals for Super was to eliminate the obnoxious power level creep that dominated to a fault the latter half of his Dragonball manga, to a point of ridiculousness that even he started to acknowledge with the events of Battle of the Gods.  Of course, he never wanted to do anything beyond Cell in the first place, and just let things go silly almost as a way of mocking what it is that his manga had become.  Buu, in a way, represents everything that was right and wrong with his story:  a childish innocence belying a horrible evil.  Regardless, after the God ki power up and Super Cyan, he hasn't had the characters change or improve in a remarkable way for a long time now.  The concept of power increases is mostly gone.  Aside form catching the old guard up, Goku is pretty much capped in terms of power ups.  You're not going to get Super Cyan 2.  At best you'll get him doing the Kaioken thing with his Super Saiyan Blue, or the Vegitto fusion using Blue, or something.  Power ups will come from technique manipulation and other "ace in the hole" moves, which was what Dragonball was mostly about until Z killed that noise.

Or at least I hope so.  Goku has heretofore not really trained much in the same fashion since the Frieza Member Berry story arc, nor has Vegeta.  They is what they is at this point.

And I say this because here's Buu doing his thing, and the biggest reveal was that none of the U7 guys could sense how strong the U9 guys were, which brings the matches into an area of unfamiliarity we haven't seen in a while.  One of the stupider things about the power creep phenomenon was how the newly powered up character, usually Goku, instantaneously knew they could just curb stomp someone, or take a big hit, or whatever, without any kind of problem because they could just sense the energy difference.  With that out the window, now they have to be careful.

But that doesn't provide much fun when a curbstomp battle happens anyway.  Buu just takes all the hits, enjoying life like the fat tub of retard he is, because that's just how shit goes.  Eliminating the power sensing didn't eliminate the ****ing stupid, which I wanted to roll my eyes at hard.  On another note, I don't think I've ever head Buu talk this much.  The actor almost couldn't stay in character because of it.
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Offline TypicalIdiotFan

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Re: Dragon Ball Super
« Reply #14 on: April 16, 2017, 01:57:39 AM »
86:

The formal reintroduction of Android 17 has some people up in arms, seeing a show 17 is apparently strong enough to keep up with Goku in SSB.  I'm not sure why anybody is surprised by this, seeing as how, as I mentioned in the last post, Toiryama wanted to eliminate the power creep that has plagued Dragonball for all of "Z".  People are forgetting the Androids are humans with cybernetic cellular mods, unlimited power engines, and so on and so forth.  There's no reason 17 or 18 couldn't continue to get stronger.  If Frieza can accomplish a lot in 4 months of training, so can they, and they were already stronger than Frieza.  18 just has no reason to do so, while 17 appears to at least have the desire, even if his motivations are no longer unwholesome.

The big irk here is introducing a heretofore unmentioned Android 17 family, but only teasing us and never showing them.  Part of me thinks it'd be hilarious if 17 ended up with the female version of Krillin, but I'm not sure what that would look or be like.  Adopting two kids is also interesting, because while generations are important to all Toriyama's stories, he always uses the next to surpass the previous (Z was heading, or headed, in that direction as well until Gohan got nerfed for reasons nobody understands).  With Goten, Trunks, Pan, Bra, Uub, Marron, and possibly 17's kids, you have a crowd set up for stories that focuses away from Goku and co and onto the next generation.  Whether they do that or not remains to be seen.

Considering how much ****ing money Goku alone makes Toei, I'd doubt it.
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