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Author Topic: A thank you and hello  (Read 9204 times)

Offline Shadowmage

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Re: A thank you and hello
« Reply #15 on: January 25, 2014, 04:48:32 PM »
I got most of your complaints with the series to be honest, but I can't help but feel you've made canyons out of cracks in the grand scheme of things. I just felt that the material itself was so strong that it ultimately shines through the directors misguided decisions. The show was carried into the higher echelons of anime for me simply because of how Arakawa's engaging writing/world-buliding, along with the excellent production values, kept me from noticing the flaws until after the fact. My problem with your review is that it's really too focused on the details of the show's presentation (which I get is important) rather then strength of the content.

To be honest, I totally get that mentality.  One of the greatest criticisms of the Gundam franchise that I have no good argument against is the way in which everything is presented is deeply flawed.  However, i still love the shows despite it because the ideas presented resonate with me.

One of the reasons why I don't give Brotherhood the same pass is because there already exists an incarnation that nailed the presentation done a couple years before.  The other reason is the simple fact that watching the show left me kind of apathetic.  There was just nothing for me to emotionally latch onto despite really wanting to.

I recommend Mobile Suit, RX-0 and Unicorn from the Unicorn OST.

Offline imlazee247

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Re: A thank you and hello
« Reply #16 on: January 25, 2014, 08:05:18 PM »
Totally with Shadowmage on that one, I am sure the manga held up better, but original T.V. adaptation for me held much more interesting motifs for the characters to develop for me to get into. That central narrative focused on the main characters internal development as brothers seeking redemption and atonement. I thought it allowed for a more nuanced look at their internal journey as opposed to the large scale world building and global conspiracy that instead would take the focus in the second adaptation. Also the whole motif of the seven deadly sins that were spawned from committing human transmutation was much more poetic/interesting to watch unravel in my opinion. Symbolically, watching the personified affects of our the main characters desires that could never be killed, and were immortally stalking them in the shadows was bitchin'. Although I love the never stop fighting and never give up motif, the shift from the internal conflicts from the T.V. adaptations to the external conflict of a grand evil villain was not as interesting for me to watch, especially when it relied more on shounen logic. Sorry to derail, but I love that Shadowmage gave it a 5. =DDD

Also if you watch Shiki, don't forget to watch the OVAs they kick you right in the feels. It is good stuff.

Also also, regarding the gore, if you can bear through it, it can be hugely rewarding if the story is worth it. Now and then, here and there, isn't as gory, but there are some scenes that destroy me more than gore could ever do because of how the story unravels. But I would never unwatch that series. Your choices on your list will keep you entertained, Planetes is personal favorite of mine.

If you are somewhat of a neurotic shut in, like myself, I also recommend Welcome to the NHK, the Tatami Galaxy, and some Dennou Coil. Interesting stuff.

And check out Millenium Actress, that is a desert island pick hands down.

Then watch Redline. But first do mushrooms, then watch Redline, haha.
« Last Edit: January 25, 2014, 08:10:51 PM by imlazee247 »

Offline hyperknees91

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Re: A thank you and hello
« Reply #17 on: January 25, 2014, 08:31:14 PM »
Well to shadowmages defense. I think if you compare the Nina and Hughes scene from the original to the ones in brotherhood. It's obvious which ones were far better done. Considering they were the most dramatic scenes in the show, it's kind of a big miss that brotherhood had. Actually...any scene that is shared between the two shows is better in the original (Ed vs Greed anyone?). It's too bad the original had the ass-pull ending, otherwise I think it would be seen as a far superior show.

I feel like brotherhood was just in wayyyy too much of a rush to get finished. It's good for an adrenaline rush, but it feels very flat in terms of drama and characterization. Funny because Ed technically developed far more in brotherhood, but something was really off about the way the show handled him.

I agree that the manga was a lot more fun to read though.
« Last Edit: January 25, 2014, 08:37:48 PM by hyperknees91 »

Offline Desdemondia

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Re: A thank you and hello
« Reply #18 on: January 25, 2014, 10:12:45 PM »
haha I HAVE SEEN IT, MY ONLY COMPLAINT IS I HAVE ONLY SEEN IT ONCE.
Forgiven. whew.
And yes, I actually have been reading the reviews and not just the number! lol but admittedly skimmed through a lot, and also - the images. Kinda like judging a book by its cover, can't help it. If it's in a drawing style that I like or am familiar with, I will probably skim through a review and find important points. And for a drawing style that I'm not accustomed to or don't like, I'll probably read more carefully.
This is probably also one of the reasons why I don't like recent shows - the anime style - those stupid big eyed highschool girls.
Yeah, definitely understand that as I do that myself though gradually been getting out of it as I've largely found that series may be completely different from what it looks like, however, I certainly still have relatively more narrow criteria for art. Like for instance, VN styles of light skimmy and extremely generic pieces of crap featuring the usual highschool girl(s) on the cover.. yeah well hell no. Can't help it.

you should try watching Dr. Ozaki's recorded experiment in episode 14. I'd say it's even more cringeworthy.
Instead of cringeworthy, Ozaki's special was more like..... glorious. Nao's episode was also a masterfully done moment to be remembered.
Death Note undeniably gave off the greatest high ever for some early moments.

In a slightly half-hearted defense, FMAB was satisfying in that it transitioned smoothly and followed a solid basis of logic with the (manga's) plot, resolving ends well. It was also went along with BONES paying attention to details of the animation in each episode. The bits of super deformed and other humor might have been off-putting but in my way of thinking, it seemed more like a juggling with the balance of a range of emotions, accenting by contrasting with the critical climaxes.
FMA on the other hand did not develop as well nor as many of the side characters in comparison to brotherhood; I'm looking at you Marcoh and Hawkeye. Although the characterization and sincere feeling from the drama etc. were definitely deeper when it came to the main characters.. There were also some diversions with side stories that followed the typical face-off against stereotypically power-hungry villains and were pretty much just fillers, albeit half-decently interesting; however in comparison, Brotherhood simply feels so solid from nearly every episode counting. FMA had enough little mishaps in attention to detail and to name a few off the top, Envy's true form suspicious plothole, Archer's rehabilitation, bloodseal's fear of water etc. etc. Mostly the gripes about it might seem comparatively trivial but indeed, as hyperknees said, that ending was a huge ass-pull that was a big WTF to me. I didn't like it. At all.

Now, if FMA never happened and only Brotherhood was the only adaptation of the franchise, would FMAB have really deserved a 5? It seems to me that many judge it almost solely through comparison to the anime-original and though I certainly understand their praises and comparisons, it seems a little, idk, one-sided? Definitely can't deny that for me, fmab was an extremely enjoyable watch though.

Anyhow, in the end, I can only say both are just different and an extremely divisive topic, and with their flaws or well-done aspects which I think, all just come down to what you value more in a show.
Cautiously, a few more excellent shows in my opinion if you haven't seen them yet already which btw are from pretty recent years :P :
-Hyouka
-Psycho-Pass
-Tatami Galaxy- this one I'd be a bit careful with..as really a big read-a-thon/talk-a-thon it took some effort for me to get through, though the payoff at the end was more than enough. Likewise, with Tatami, there's also Katanagatari which is just a big talk-a-thon and whose first episode was imo the worst out of it, but finished nicely. Also Mawaru Penguindrum. Now, I mention all 3 of these in one bullet as I sorta think of them all together as being exhausting to get through and requiring patience, yet great shows, particularly with their wrapping up in the first two.
EDIT: adding Zetsuen no Tempest too
« Last Edit: January 25, 2014, 10:19:44 PM by Desdemondia »

Offline Marid King

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Re: A thank you and hello
« Reply #19 on: January 25, 2014, 10:34:48 PM »
I have never understood why people praise Penguindrum so much. I forced myself through the whole thing because I was new to anime and read all the glowing reviews, but I never saw the brilliance that everyone says is there.
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Offline TypicalIdiotFan

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Re: A thank you and hello
« Reply #20 on: January 26, 2014, 03:19:04 AM »
You need more pretentious eyes to watch Penguindrum.

/adjusts fedora
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Offline Kylaran

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Re: A thank you and hello
« Reply #21 on: January 28, 2014, 12:32:38 PM »
Did someone mention pretentious? I've got plenty of that over here where I live.

People already mentioned some excellent shows like Tatami Galaxy, but if you're going to watch Penguindrum I think Utena is a far better -- and more widely acclaimed -- option to watch if you haven't seen it yet.

Offline Muds

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Re: A thank you and hello
« Reply #22 on: January 28, 2014, 05:19:39 PM »
Now, if FMA never happened and only Brotherhood was the only adaptation of the franchise, would FMAB have really deserved a 5? It seems to me that many judge it almost solely through comparison to the anime-original and though I certainly understand their praises and comparisons, it seems a little, idk, one-sided? Definitely can't deny that for me, fmab was an extremely enjoyable watch though.

I think that's what I'm getting at here, the 5 is coming from a comparison to the first and not so much to all the other anime.

When we talk about the shared episodes, it is very obvious the first anime was better and isn't that also why they rushed it in Brotherhood in the first 15 episodes? If it's already been done, and done so well why would they do it again? But then they can't exactly skip it either because it's part of the storyline. I've always thought that was the intention of Brotherhood, to fast forward everything in the first 15 or 20 episodes until new material came along.
If Brotherhood deserved a low score because of that, then I would suggest giving the original the same because the second half of the anime certainly does not match that of Brotherhood. If that makes any sense.

For anyone who hasn't seen FMA, I would still recommend they go see Brotherhood instead - as a whole, I still think it's better. Music was better in the first series though, that brotherhood theme... dayamn.

I haven't had the chance to check out the list of anime... don't even know where to start, all this gore talk - maybe I should start with Shiki.

I think I gave up on Penguindrum lol

Offline Zeitgeist

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Re: A thank you and hello
« Reply #23 on: January 28, 2014, 06:24:08 PM »
Music was better in the first series

What? Akira Senju composed the music for Brotherhood.

Offline Muds

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Re: A thank you and hello
« Reply #24 on: January 28, 2014, 08:19:05 PM »
I don't know who Akira Senju is!! Googled him to find that the only one I know composed by him is FMAB :O Don't get me wrong, it was still good, just... just... I found the first better.

Offline Zeitgeist

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Re: A thank you and hello
« Reply #25 on: January 28, 2014, 08:29:39 PM »
You don't know who Akira Senju is!?!?!? He composed the music for Red Garden, which is possibly the greatest anime EVAR.

I was just f***ing with you. In all seriousness, the original FMA was scored by Michiru Oshima who is a god in her own right. She has composed music for Zetsuen no Tempest, Sound of the Sky,  Le Chevalier d'…on, and Tatami Galaaxy. All of which are just of the top of my head.

Edit: Don't forget Xam'd. That literally just came to me as I sent it.

Offline KS

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Re: A thank you and hello
« Reply #26 on: January 28, 2014, 11:26:06 PM »
You don't know who Akira Senju is!?!?!? He composed the music for Red Garden, which is possibly the greatest anime EVAR.

I was just f***ing with you. In all seriousness, the original FMA was scored by Michiru Oshima who is a god in her own right. She has composed music for Zetsuen no Tempest, Sound of the Sky,  Le Chevalier d'…on, and Tatami Galaaxy. All of which are just of the top of my head.

Edit: Don't forget Xam'd. That literally just came to me as I sent it.

I've never seen Red Garden but I love the OST.  Senju Akira is my favorite composer though and probably the only one who's soundtracks I collect just for him and not the show though.  There's something about the emotion he's able to pack into a song that I don't think any other composer for anime quite manages, even some that are considered to be the best of the best like Yoko Kanno or Joe Hisaishi.  Interestingly one of the few to come close was Michiru Oshima herself with Zetsuen no Tempest.  The choice to substitute one for the other between FMA series kind of makes sense in that regard as I feel they kind of have a similar style even though Akira's is more refined.

Offline Zeitgeist

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Re: A thank you and hello
« Reply #27 on: January 29, 2014, 12:34:24 AM »
It's a real shame that the music within anime is often overlooked by much of the fan base. There are so many amazing composers and so many great soundtracks which such variety...Speaking of Variety, shoehorned that in there, Yasuharu Takanashi scored Shiki. On top of Shiki having such a swell soundtrack Takanshi also composed the Celtic awesomeness of Fairy Tail. His score single-handedly made that show watchable for me.

If you like the horror vibes of Shiki Takanashi also composed the score for Jigoku Shoujo.

Offline TypicalIdiotFan

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Re: A thank you and hello
« Reply #28 on: January 29, 2014, 11:45:55 AM »
Well, music is often unappreciated because it isn't actively being listened to.  You'll hear fans hoot and holler about OPs and EDs and insert songs, because those have lyrics and you have to kind of pay attention to see if you like it.

Background music is just that; it is designed to be picked up almost subconsciously while the show is doing its thang.  Most people don't REALIZE that the music manipulates them while watching the show, bringing on extra tension, or hope, or romance.  But, by being manipulated, they are actually appreciating the score, just not actively.

BGM is a tricky thing to pull off, and needs not only a good composer, but a good director who knows when to use it.  Sometimes the reverse is true, if the composer is writing music for scenes that have already been shot, then he becomes, essentially, the "director".  It really is an underappreciated process, but it isn't like people don't hear it.  I know lots of people who whistle the Harry Potter theme, for example, and everybody knows the blaring Star Wars music, but fewer people will even recognize the song playing in the background during Aladdin's magic carpet ride escape from the Cave of Wonders or the little ditty playing while Spock and Kirk are talking in Spock's quarters in Wrath of Khan.  That's just the reality of it.
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Offline Zeitgeist

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Re: A thank you and hello
« Reply #29 on: January 29, 2014, 12:38:15 PM »
Never short on Star Trek references

Edit: Since no one had posted since my previous facetious response... Yes "BGM" by there very nature are meant to take a backseat to w/e it is they are accentuating; that doesn't mean they ought  be completely ignored. The internet is a rife with "parodies" which simply remove the BGM of a film/scene in order to highlight the significance of said music. Ultimately, not that I have revelated any points thus far, OST's are very much important. Since the earlier analogy has failed, MUSIC FTW. BLAH various cognitive experiments, music transcends neuro-chemical reasoning and is pretty awesome. Music is just swell.

IDKWTF I just said. Disregard this entire post.
« Last Edit: January 29, 2014, 05:03:17 PM by Zeitgeist »
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